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Wandering Adventure Party

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  3. https://meatcastle.substack.com/p/talking-about-adventures-systems An interesting grab-bag of a piece that touches on the state of #ttrpg reviewing.

https://meatcastle.substack.com/p/talking-about-adventures-systems An interesting grab-bag of a piece that touches on the state of #ttrpg reviewing.

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  • Roger BW 😷R Roger BW 😷

    @Taskerland @Printdevil Oh yeah, I first met that with high-end digital cameras: big expensive thing, and some people want to be reassured they've bought the right one.

    Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau Vazh
    wrote last edited by
    #17

    @RogerBW @Printdevil Cameras pose a similar challenge as they're tools and people can use tools in any number of different ways. Impossible for a reviewer to know if a given camera will fit in a particular workflow. Even 'sharpness' of lenses is not a neutral characteristics as some lenses are pleasingly imperfect for some people.

    CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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    • Roger BW 😷R Roger BW 😷

      @Taskerland @Printdevil Oh yeah, I first met that with high-end digital cameras: big expensive thing, and some people want to be reassured they've bought the right one.

      CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
      CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
      Charnock
      wrote last edited by
      #18

      Like Stereophiles, Camera Owners are a special form of lunatic.

      I've seen it at the extreme end of Studios going almost bankrupt because of sudden urgent need of "the £20,000 lens they will use once"

      This is why I recommend fixating on a single appearance monster from the early seventies. You can feel like a compleatist in a matter of hours, without having to teach yourself Japanese like @vortiwife

      @RogerBW @Taskerland

      Kera VortiwifeV 1 Reply Last reply
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      • CharnockP Charnock

        Like Stereophiles, Camera Owners are a special form of lunatic.

        I've seen it at the extreme end of Studios going almost bankrupt because of sudden urgent need of "the £20,000 lens they will use once"

        This is why I recommend fixating on a single appearance monster from the early seventies. You can feel like a compleatist in a matter of hours, without having to teach yourself Japanese like @vortiwife

        @RogerBW @Taskerland

        Kera VortiwifeV This user is from outside of this forum
        Kera VortiwifeV This user is from outside of this forum
        Kera Vortiwife
        wrote last edited by
        #19

        @Printdevil @RogerBW @Taskerland i know that saying the words "Leica M8" can activate a kind of manchurian candidate response in a certain kind of camera nerd

        CharnockP 2 Replies Last reply
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        • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

          @RogerBW @Printdevil Cameras pose a similar challenge as they're tools and people can use tools in any number of different ways. Impossible for a reviewer to know if a given camera will fit in a particular workflow. Even 'sharpness' of lenses is not a neutral characteristics as some lenses are pleasingly imperfect for some people.

          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
          Charnock
          wrote last edited by
          #20

          People have made careers out of weird old imperfect lenses indeed.

          Anything with tools always tends to border between jealous modernity, frothingly specific obsession and wondering if you are collecting Victorian ones because they have a dragon on the handle.

          @Taskerland @RogerBW

          Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
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          • Kera VortiwifeV Kera Vortiwife

            @Printdevil @RogerBW @Taskerland i know that saying the words "Leica M8" can activate a kind of manchurian candidate response in a certain kind of camera nerd

            CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
            CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
            Charnock
            wrote last edited by
            #21

            Anything you couldn't tell a story about both technically and narratively was described as "a snap" by my employers.

            Which still annoys me because they retroactively made everything up to imply they were artistic.

            @vortiwife @RogerBW @Taskerland

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            • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

              @Printdevil If I started behaving like that people would just assume that I had hit my head. @RogerBW

              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
              Charnock
              wrote last edited by
              #22

              "have you hit your head on the skirting boards again?"

              "They're just so high!"

              @Taskerland @RogerBW

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              • CharnockP Charnock

                People have made careers out of weird old imperfect lenses indeed.

                Anything with tools always tends to border between jealous modernity, frothingly specific obsession and wondering if you are collecting Victorian ones because they have a dragon on the handle.

                @Taskerland @RogerBW

                Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                Moreau Vazh
                wrote last edited by
                #23

                @Printdevil Also, there are people who are camera nerds and guitar nerds who drone on about specs and, by and large, they are never good musicians or photographers. @RogerBW

                CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                  @Printdevil Also, there are people who are camera nerds and guitar nerds who drone on about specs and, by and large, they are never good musicians or photographers. @RogerBW

                  CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                  CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                  Charnock
                  wrote last edited by
                  #24

                  I think that's what leads to their/peoples fascination with old cameras or low spec cameras, or process methods like wet development and pin holes. Or pre-decent digital. They've grown up in a time when digital cameras are fantastic, guitar tech isn't soldering and hope, and car batteries don't need topped up in the morning. There's no creative tension. No forced necessity. So you get people with a £10-15k rig getting more fun out of a disposable.

                  @Taskerland @RogerBW

                  Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • Kera VortiwifeV Kera Vortiwife

                    @Printdevil @RogerBW @Taskerland i know that saying the words "Leica M8" can activate a kind of manchurian candidate response in a certain kind of camera nerd

                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                    Charnock
                    wrote last edited by
                    #25

                    At his point I should note I'm very disappointed in the lack of gargoyles in the Bokeh effect now available in camera on most digitals.

                    @vortiwife @RogerBW @Taskerland

                    Roger BW 😷R 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • CharnockP Charnock

                      I think that's what leads to their/peoples fascination with old cameras or low spec cameras, or process methods like wet development and pin holes. Or pre-decent digital. They've grown up in a time when digital cameras are fantastic, guitar tech isn't soldering and hope, and car batteries don't need topped up in the morning. There's no creative tension. No forced necessity. So you get people with a £10-15k rig getting more fun out of a disposable.

                      @Taskerland @RogerBW

                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                      Moreau Vazh
                      wrote last edited by
                      #26

                      @RogerBW @Printdevil Indeed. Discovering that material constraints are often aesthetic constraints and aesthetic constraints can be very productive.

                      CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • CharnockP Charnock

                        At his point I should note I'm very disappointed in the lack of gargoyles in the Bokeh effect now available in camera on most digitals.

                        @vortiwife @RogerBW @Taskerland

                        Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                        Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                        Roger BW 😷
                        wrote last edited by
                        #27

                        @Printdevil @vortiwife @Taskerland You can't see the gargoyles?
                        Oh.

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                        • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                          @RogerBW @Printdevil Indeed. Discovering that material constraints are often aesthetic constraints and aesthetic constraints can be very productive.

                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                          Charnock
                          wrote last edited by
                          #28

                          That's what has lead to so many "500 Ideas to Improve..." type books in photography I think. You don't learn via old methods of desperation and waiting for development time (or Boots), people have all the editing, manipulation, and creative tools on tap. Confronted with everything all at once, people seek creative guardrails.

                          Or just ask an ai and don't worry about it.

                          @Taskerland @RogerBW

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                          • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                            D) These issues are tough to navigate and are partly why I stopped reviewing ttrpg products:

                            I can only ever speak to my experience running a game and given how far outside all of the major silos my preferred playstyle falls, I suspect it was not useful.

                            Also, ttrpg people don't really know what to do with reviewers... What they want is what they have: Influencers who can make them feel enthusiastic about products they most likely won't read let alone play.

                            MalinM This user is from outside of this forum
                            MalinM This user is from outside of this forum
                            Malin
                            wrote last edited by
                            #29

                            @Taskerland I recall your reviews saying 'you'll need to run this from a record cover or print the awkward shape', and another noting 'GMing advice is absent, this game assumes a level of cultural knowledge'.

                            The reviews didn't seem all that subjective, because every other group would have to deal with the same things you described.

                            Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
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                            • MalinM Malin

                              @Taskerland I recall your reviews saying 'you'll need to run this from a record cover or print the awkward shape', and another noting 'GMing advice is absent, this game assumes a level of cultural knowledge'.

                              The reviews didn't seem all that subjective, because every other group would have to deal with the same things you described.

                              Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                              Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                              Moreau Vazh
                              wrote last edited by
                              #30

                              @malin Some characteristics are objective, this is true.

                              I did also make an effort to meet games where they are, even while it dragged both me and my game out of our comfort zones (which is another reason why I stopped reviewing).

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