Because a LOT of people are missing the point:
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@jb I don't approve of capitalism occupying Earth orbit; my point was that (at least according to Manley, and what I do understand of physics and orbital mechanics) it's not implausible that what the Muskrat is doing here is actually sensible from a capitalist standpoint.
His whole existence is a grift, and he needs to be stopped, but this particular part of it seems far less of a con than (e.g.) the "cybertruck".
@woozle @jb Tough luck: all we've got in orbit today is capitalism, plus a couple of government-funded puppet shows showcasing "space science" while paying huge back-handers to corporations.
This is the reason we can't have nice things. (I prefer the term "crapitalism" to "enshittification", but you get the picture either way.)
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@ApostateEnglishman "None of the big ideas ever materialize" except the launcher with the payload of the space shuttle at $12M/flight that is *more reusable* than the shuttle ( 8 day turnaround between flights! 50 reuses per booster and climbing!) or disrupting the car industry by making EVs sexy. Or the low orbit comsat cluster.
Most of his bullshit evaporates on close inspection or goes wrongβbut enough of it works to keep everything afloat.
(Shun anything he says about software, though.)
@cstross The Sleight Doctor π
The innovation wasn't the cars.
It was implementing a transport _system_
Now once there is a system of a supply network for recharging, and vehicles to recharge, other people will do it, and eventually as commodities and better.The thing with Spacex wasn't launches and missions, it was a transport _system_.
Now, what is the complete system being floated?
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@FaithfullJohn Well yes, but we need to criticize it because it's bullshit: "rational and responsible use" have nothing to do with the stock market.
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@woozle @jb Tough luck: all we've got in orbit today is capitalism, plus a couple of government-funded puppet shows showcasing "space science" while paying huge back-handers to corporations.
This is the reason we can't have nice things. (I prefer the term "crapitalism" to "enshittification", but you get the picture either way.)
@cstross Indeed, I know -- it's where we are now.
Perhaps not too late to stop it from metastasizing, but it's going to be a hard battle.
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Capitalism is a self-limiting problem.
(Whether it limits *us* at the same time is an open question for the time being.)
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@raymaccarthy @oldgeek @lucien The point of starlink is low latency, which means low orbit. Which in turn requires lots of them to ensure there are no gaps in coverage. (And now they're working on satellite-to-satellite high bandwidth laser mesh networking to increase capacity.)
I think you underestimate the scale of aviation and shipping, not to mention railway transport.
@cstross @oldgeek @lucien
No, I don't because I was RF R&D in an ISP with fibre, mobile, Fixed Wireless and Satellite. They also had datacentres.Railway is better served by Cellular.
Obviously in LEO you need a load to have continuous coverage, but to do the equivalent of rural fibre or cellular for trains you need orders of magnitude more.
Even cellular is being done badly due to too big cells and regulatory capture. I've dealt with the Irish regulator, Comreg.
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Because a LOT of people are missing the point:
No, Elon Musk is NOT serious about putting a million data centres into orbit. It can't work: laws of physics say "nope".
But SpaceX is expected to go public this year.
Elon is talking up his company's future prospects in front of gullible investors because he needs a growth narrative beyond Starlink, which is already priced in. Something to justify the Starship proram beyond NASA's lunar ambitions.
So it's salesman's bullshit, lies for fools.
Elon Musk very rarely actually builds what he promotes.
He is a traitorous money laundering conduit for petrostate despots.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/oct/25/elon-musk-has-been-in-regular-contact-with-putin-for-two-years-say-reportsPhotos show Elon Musk hanging out with Jared Kushner at the World Cup final
Elon Musk was spotted with Donald Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, at the World Cup final Sunday. This comes as Congress is investigating Kushner.
Business Insider (www.businessinsider.com)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2025/05/13/trump-tech-execs-riyadh/
https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/19/tech/saudi-arabia-us-chips-ai-race
Why top tech CEOs joined Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia
Several major tech CEOs joined President Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia this week. It's part of a thaw in the once-strained relationship between Big Tech and the oil-rich state.
NPR (www.npr.org)
Even his investors like Larry Ellison, Putin, & Alwaleed bin Talal recognize his utility in corrupting elections for the richest fascists on the planet.
Musk facilitates mass financial frauds.
That's it, that's all he does, defraud.
1/
-
Elon Musk very rarely actually builds what he promotes.
He is a traitorous money laundering conduit for petrostate despots.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/oct/25/elon-musk-has-been-in-regular-contact-with-putin-for-two-years-say-reportsPhotos show Elon Musk hanging out with Jared Kushner at the World Cup final
Elon Musk was spotted with Donald Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, at the World Cup final Sunday. This comes as Congress is investigating Kushner.
Business Insider (www.businessinsider.com)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2025/05/13/trump-tech-execs-riyadh/
https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/19/tech/saudi-arabia-us-chips-ai-race
Why top tech CEOs joined Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia
Several major tech CEOs joined President Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia this week. It's part of a thaw in the once-strained relationship between Big Tech and the oil-rich state.
NPR (www.npr.org)
Even his investors like Larry Ellison, Putin, & Alwaleed bin Talal recognize his utility in corrupting elections for the richest fascists on the planet.
Musk facilitates mass financial frauds.
That's it, that's all he does, defraud.
1/
2/
Musk's List of "Failure to Deliver" frauds:
1. Man on Mars
2. Hyperloop train
3. Robotics
4. xAI achieving AGI
5. Flying cars
6. DOGE 'efficiencies'
7. Lunar tourism
8. No covid
9. Candy
Everything Elon Musk promised in 2025, but didn't deliver
Elon Musk made many 2025 promises that he couldn't keep.
Mashable (mashable.com)
Musk's actually delivered:
1. The largest data breaches in US history
2. Joined the military industrial complex
3. A fossil fuel funded fascist alliance
4. Kleptocracy
5. Can foment far right riots with a single tweet
6. Mass hate campaigns for Nazis -
Because a LOT of people are missing the point:
No, Elon Musk is NOT serious about putting a million data centres into orbit. It can't work: laws of physics say "nope".
But SpaceX is expected to go public this year.
Elon is talking up his company's future prospects in front of gullible investors because he needs a growth narrative beyond Starlink, which is already priced in. Something to justify the Starship proram beyond NASA's lunar ambitions.
So it's salesman's bullshit, lies for fools.
About as brilliant idea as the Cybertruck was.
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2/
Musk's List of "Failure to Deliver" frauds:
1. Man on Mars
2. Hyperloop train
3. Robotics
4. xAI achieving AGI
5. Flying cars
6. DOGE 'efficiencies'
7. Lunar tourism
8. No covid
9. Candy
Everything Elon Musk promised in 2025, but didn't deliver
Elon Musk made many 2025 promises that he couldn't keep.
Mashable (mashable.com)
Musk's actually delivered:
1. The largest data breaches in US history
2. Joined the military industrial complex
3. A fossil fuel funded fascist alliance
4. Kleptocracy
5. Can foment far right riots with a single tweet
6. Mass hate campaigns for Nazis@Npars01 You forgot the traffic-less tunnels in your "failure to deliver" list π€
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Elon Musk very rarely actually builds what he promotes.
He is a traitorous money laundering conduit for petrostate despots.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/oct/25/elon-musk-has-been-in-regular-contact-with-putin-for-two-years-say-reportsPhotos show Elon Musk hanging out with Jared Kushner at the World Cup final
Elon Musk was spotted with Donald Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, at the World Cup final Sunday. This comes as Congress is investigating Kushner.
Business Insider (www.businessinsider.com)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2025/05/13/trump-tech-execs-riyadh/
https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/19/tech/saudi-arabia-us-chips-ai-race
Why top tech CEOs joined Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia
Several major tech CEOs joined President Trump on his trip to Saudi Arabia this week. It's part of a thaw in the once-strained relationship between Big Tech and the oil-rich state.
NPR (www.npr.org)
Even his investors like Larry Ellison, Putin, & Alwaleed bin Talal recognize his utility in corrupting elections for the richest fascists on the planet.
Musk facilitates mass financial frauds.
That's it, that's all he does, defraud.
1/
-
2/
Musk's List of "Failure to Deliver" frauds:
1. Man on Mars
2. Hyperloop train
3. Robotics
4. xAI achieving AGI
5. Flying cars
6. DOGE 'efficiencies'
7. Lunar tourism
8. No covid
9. Candy
Everything Elon Musk promised in 2025, but didn't deliver
Elon Musk made many 2025 promises that he couldn't keep.
Mashable (mashable.com)
Musk's actually delivered:
1. The largest data breaches in US history
2. Joined the military industrial complex
3. A fossil fuel funded fascist alliance
4. Kleptocracy
5. Can foment far right riots with a single tweet
6. Mass hate campaigns for Nazis -
@bornach @bellegraylane @cstross just waiting for The Boring Company to pivot to AIβ¦
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@cstross It was obvious bollocks (just like hyperloop, the boring company etcβ¦), just I didnβt know why he was boosting it as I didnβt realise he was planning an IPO this year. Tosser.
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(Some) lawyers can (and will, if paid enough) argue against physics, but their chance of winning (other than the money you're paying them) is less than infinitesimal. (They're hoping they will be paid more than they get sanctioned for.)
@Cadbury_Moose
In my experience, those lawyers are called politicians
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Because a LOT of people are missing the point:
No, Elon Musk is NOT serious about putting a million data centres into orbit. It can't work: laws of physics say "nope".
But SpaceX is expected to go public this year.
Elon is talking up his company's future prospects in front of gullible investors because he needs a growth narrative beyond Starlink, which is already priced in. Something to justify the Starship proram beyond NASA's lunar ambitions.
So it's salesman's bullshit, lies for fools.
@cstross this applies to every company that mentions data centres in space.
Most tech "journalists" seem hesitant to ask basic questions about this shit because what if they start having to ask basic questions about everything. Sounds like a lot of work!
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Because a LOT of people are missing the point:
No, Elon Musk is NOT serious about putting a million data centres into orbit. It can't work: laws of physics say "nope".
But SpaceX is expected to go public this year.
Elon is talking up his company's future prospects in front of gullible investors because he needs a growth narrative beyond Starlink, which is already priced in. Something to justify the Starship proram beyond NASA's lunar ambitions.
So it's salesman's bullshit, lies for fools.
@cstross The most compelling argument I've heard for putting datacenters in space (in the "didn't immediately discount it as a stupid idea but took some time to engage with it" sense) was from Scott Manley, notorious fan of everything space-related, and even he concluded that it only makes sense as an end-run around terrestrial regulation (i.e. it's a stupid and expensive idea but in the grand scheme of markets it may be cheaper than "buying enough politicians to steal a community's water rights out from under them so you can get the permits to build on land").
Which... Yeah, when that's the forcing function, maybe we tech folk should sit and have a think about the entire project.
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@cstross The most compelling argument I've heard for putting datacenters in space (in the "didn't immediately discount it as a stupid idea but took some time to engage with it" sense) was from Scott Manley, notorious fan of everything space-related, and even he concluded that it only makes sense as an end-run around terrestrial regulation (i.e. it's a stupid and expensive idea but in the grand scheme of markets it may be cheaper than "buying enough politicians to steal a community's water rights out from under them so you can get the permits to build on land").
Which... Yeah, when that's the forcing function, maybe we tech folk should sit and have a think about the entire project.
Like, we already have trouble keeping things cool in space and thereβs also the whole βspace is a deadly laserβ radiation thing. I really canβt imagine how thereβd be any benefit to putting a data center in space. Like, at all.
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@rk @cstross Exactly. It's literally a "This is a stupid idea and the only reason we do it is we were forbidden from putting it on Earth" kinda thing.
As I said at one point or other, to paraphrase myself, "Sure, there's no convenient cooling and radiation will scramble your data, but just think how much CSAM you can store out of reach of any terrestrial law... Until you try and download it and they bust your ass the moment it hits a radio dish!"
οΈ π€¬
