Skip to content
0
  • Home
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • World
  • Users
  • Groups
  • Home
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • World
  • Users
  • Groups
Skins
  • Light
  • Brite
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (Sketchy)
  • No Skin
Collapse

Wandering Adventure Party

  1. Home
  2. Uncategorized
  3. Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Uncategorized
23 Posts 14 Posters 0 Views
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • Ari does not complyA Ari does not comply

    @johncarlosbaez thank you for posting this. It is absolutely fascinating!

    That is an ongoing conversation in both herbalism and in native plant restoration work. Should we be looking at what "pristine" areas were like and be emulating them? Should we be upset when what we plant doesn't emulate what we assume was originally growing there?

    Or, should we be flexible, and go with what works? Let the plants guide us, let the plants tell us what they need and where they want to go?

    I'm in the second camp; not only do these plants know exactly what they need, you can't force them to do anything (trust me, I've spent years trying to convince home gardeners that they should add native plants to their yards, but also cautioning them that they can be unruly and downright willful about whether or not they like being in your garden).

    They migrate, they creep, they communicate, they make choices about where they're going to grow or not grow. They have a lot more intelligence than we give them credit.

    I love that these folks are approaching these areas without bias and just learning about what's happening there now. It's amazing!

    Climate Jenny 2.1C This user is from outside of this forum
    Climate Jenny 2.1C This user is from outside of this forum
    Climate Jenny 2.1
    wrote last edited by
    #7

    @arisummerland @johncarlosbaez I’m with you: Let the plants decide. It’s never clear how much human intervention is helpful, but the track record thus far suggests that the prudent thing is for people to do less. Maybe reintroduce some species and see if they take hold, and maybe remove “crap plants” to let plants that take longer to establish have a chance. But then stand back and let evolution do its thing.

    John Carlos BaezJ 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

      Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

      She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

      Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

      And thus the Slag Queens were born.

      Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

      The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

      • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

      Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

      (2/2)

      JanisJ This user is from outside of this forum
      JanisJ This user is from outside of this forum
      Janis
      wrote last edited by
      #8

      @johncarlosbaez I've heard the campus and adjacent ponds are also getting some curious attention. I hope they're able to connect with some students to grow and/or replicate the group!

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • LarryQ Larry

        @johncarlosbaez
        https://www.penguinrandomhouse.ca/books/243204/the-new-wild-by-fred-pearce/9780807039557

        John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
        John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
        John Carlos Baez
        wrote last edited by
        #9

        @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

        LarryQ MozM cbudC 3 Replies Last reply
        0
        • Climate Jenny 2.1C Climate Jenny 2.1

          @arisummerland @johncarlosbaez I’m with you: Let the plants decide. It’s never clear how much human intervention is helpful, but the track record thus far suggests that the prudent thing is for people to do less. Maybe reintroduce some species and see if they take hold, and maybe remove “crap plants” to let plants that take longer to establish have a chance. But then stand back and let evolution do its thing.

          John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
          John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
          John Carlos Baez
          wrote last edited by
          #10

          @ClimateJenny @arisummerland - it's possible that in the long run, fighting invasive species is a losing battle in most cases. Maybe it's better to just let succession take place: often the first stages of succession involve scrappy species that can survive tough conditions, while later a more complex ecosystem develops. But I'm no expert. I just agree with both of you that plants tends to know more about these issues than people.

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • HardlyH Hardly

            @johncarlosbaez

            Lived half my life in the Calumet Region. Nature does thrive in some places among the heavy industry. Thanks for sharing the story.

            Link Preview ImageLink Preview Image
            John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
            John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
            John Carlos Baez
            wrote last edited by
            #11

            @hardly - sure thing! I've never been to the Calumet region.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

              @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

              LarryQ This user is from outside of this forum
              LarryQ This user is from outside of this forum
              Larry
              wrote last edited by
              #12

              @johncarlosbaez
              Let me know your impression?

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

                MozM This user is from outside of this forum
                MozM This user is from outside of this forum
                Moz
                wrote last edited by
                #13

                @johncarlosbaez @quoidian isn't 'pristine nature' one of those impossible ideals? I'm in Australia where we've had 100m of sea level rise since people arrived so questions like "what would nature look like here" are pretty abstract.

                "The Biggest Estate on Earth" is a book asking which bits people made.

                Morgan ⚧️R 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • MozM Moz

                  @johncarlosbaez @quoidian isn't 'pristine nature' one of those impossible ideals? I'm in Australia where we've had 100m of sea level rise since people arrived so questions like "what would nature look like here" are pretty abstract.

                  "The Biggest Estate on Earth" is a book asking which bits people made.

                  Morgan ⚧️R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Morgan ⚧️R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Morgan ⚧️
                  wrote last edited by
                  #14

                  @moz @johncarlosbaez @quoidian impossible and also colonial in nature. E.g. Spaniards arriving on Turtle Island saw the way indigenous people were actively stewarding the land and demonized it, encouraging instead to leave "wilderness" without any human intervention. Now, a lot of those areas where colonists interfered with native stewardship have been doing worse off without human intervention, e.g. building up kindling for huge ecosystem-destroying wildfires instead of small controlled burns

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                    Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

                    Steel mills dumped molten slag in parts of Chicago and nearby areas. The slag hardened in layers up to 5 meters deep. These places became barren wastelands. Other industries dumped hot ash and cinders there.

                    But eventually the steel mills closed.

                    The deep layers of hard, toxic material were not friendly to plants. Cottonwoods are usually 30 meters tall or more. In the slag fields, stunted cottonwoods grow to just 2 meters.

                    But rare species that could handle these conditions began to thrive. The lakeside daisy, a federally threatened species lost to Illinois for decades, turned out to grow taller on slag than on topsoil! The capitate spike-rush, last recorded in Illinois in 1894 and considered locally extinct, was rediscovered growing on slag.

                    And more! Native prairie grasses like little bluestem. Native milkweeds. Even tiny white orchids called sphinx ladies' tresses.

                    A team of women ecologists began studying these unusual landscapes. They call themselves the Slag Queens.

                    (1/2)

                    Climate Jenny 2.1C This user is from outside of this forum
                    Climate Jenny 2.1C This user is from outside of this forum
                    Climate Jenny 2.1
                    wrote last edited by
                    #15

                    @johncarlosbaez As they point out in the article, the management decisions are highly site-specific. If it’s a wasteland for miles around, go wild with the invasives.

                    But, wow. The sedge that’s been missing for more than a century? How did it get back there? One gets the impression that somewhere off in a forgotten corner, some plants have been quietly biding their time.

                    John Carlos BaezJ 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                      Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                      She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                      Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                      And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                      Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                      The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                      • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                      Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                      (2/2)

                      your auntifa liza 🇵🇷  🦛 🦦B This user is from outside of this forum
                      your auntifa liza 🇵🇷  🦛 🦦B This user is from outside of this forum
                      your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦
                      wrote last edited by
                      #16

                      @johncarlosbaez love Love LOVE THIS STORY SO MUCH! it’s about resilience outside of neoliberal, settler-capitalist conventions and not just from an ecological point of view; but a academic and scientist point of view as well.

                      John Carlos BaezJ 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                        Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                        She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                        Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                        And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                        Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                        The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                        • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                        Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                        (2/2)

                        Sci-Fi Girl5 This user is from outside of this forum
                        Sci-Fi Girl5 This user is from outside of this forum
                        Sci-Fi Girl
                        wrote last edited by
                        #17

                        @johncarlosbaez

                        Their conclusion reminds a little bit of "Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind". In as beautiful a way as possible. 💖 🌿

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • your auntifa liza 🇵🇷  🦛 🦦B your auntifa liza 🇵🇷 🦛 🦦

                          @johncarlosbaez love Love LOVE THIS STORY SO MUCH! it’s about resilience outside of neoliberal, settler-capitalist conventions and not just from an ecological point of view; but a academic and scientist point of view as well.

                          John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
                          John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
                          John Carlos Baez
                          wrote last edited by
                          #18

                          @blogdiva - yeah, it's full of deep points. You'd probably enjoy the longer version I linked to, if you haven't already read it.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • Climate Jenny 2.1C Climate Jenny 2.1

                            @johncarlosbaez As they point out in the article, the management decisions are highly site-specific. If it’s a wasteland for miles around, go wild with the invasives.

                            But, wow. The sedge that’s been missing for more than a century? How did it get back there? One gets the impression that somewhere off in a forgotten corner, some plants have been quietly biding their time.

                            John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
                            John Carlos BaezJ This user is from outside of this forum
                            John Carlos Baez
                            wrote last edited by
                            #19

                            @ClimateJenny - reminds me of how Felis silvestris is showing up in parts of Europe where human populations are declining.

                            Link Preview Image
                            John Carlos Baez (@johncarlosbaez@mathstodon.xyz)

                            Attached: 1 image Some good news in a time of darkness: the European wildcat, Felis sylvestris, is making a comeback! This thoughtful-looking example was photographed in a mountainous region of the Czech republic. The European wildcat's extreme elusiveness may have helped it avoid hunters in places where a larger native cat, the lynx, has been killed off. There may be about 140,000 European wildcats spread across more than two dozen countries. But they are very hard to find! Wildlife photographer Andrea Giovanni, who made a video of one, writes: "I'd never even thought of taking photos of wildcats, for a simple reason: I thought it was impossible, or at least, extremely difficult. It's considered 'the ghost of the forests' because it's very, very elusive, and it's hard to predict where it can be spotted. Other animals tend to follow the same trails through the forest. The wildcat goes wherever she wants to." One reason the European wildcat is coming back is increased legal protections. But another is that villages in Italy and other regions are becoming depopulated! Some are very worried about declining human populations. But it does make room for other species. That gives me some hope for the future. I got this picture, taken by Vladimír Čech Jr in the Doupov mountains, from a very nice article on the European wildcat: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20260112-rare-images-of-europes-ghost-cat For more on this species: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_wildcat Seven subspecies have been demarcated! #cats #catsOfFedi #catsOfMastodon

                            favicon

                            Mathstodon (mathstodon.xyz)

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                              Here's a tale of how nature triumphs in the end.

                              Steel mills dumped molten slag in parts of Chicago and nearby areas. The slag hardened in layers up to 5 meters deep. These places became barren wastelands. Other industries dumped hot ash and cinders there.

                              But eventually the steel mills closed.

                              The deep layers of hard, toxic material were not friendly to plants. Cottonwoods are usually 30 meters tall or more. In the slag fields, stunted cottonwoods grow to just 2 meters.

                              But rare species that could handle these conditions began to thrive. The lakeside daisy, a federally threatened species lost to Illinois for decades, turned out to grow taller on slag than on topsoil! The capitate spike-rush, last recorded in Illinois in 1894 and considered locally extinct, was rediscovered growing on slag.

                              And more! Native prairie grasses like little bluestem. Native milkweeds. Even tiny white orchids called sphinx ladies' tresses.

                              A team of women ecologists began studying these unusual landscapes. They call themselves the Slag Queens.

                              (1/2)

                              ☠️ 𝕯𝖗𝖊𝖆𝖉 𝕻𝖎𝖗𝖆𝖙𝖊 ☠️C This user is from outside of this forum
                              ☠️ 𝕯𝖗𝖊𝖆𝖉 𝕻𝖎𝖗𝖆𝖙𝖊 ☠️C This user is from outside of this forum
                              ☠️ 𝕯𝖗𝖊𝖆𝖉 𝕻𝖎𝖗𝖆𝖙𝖊 ☠️
                              wrote last edited by
                              #20
                              I've always wanted to get my hands on a slag queen.
                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                                Ecologist Alison Anastasio visited a former US Steel South Works site in Chicago. She expected to find “all crap plants” — common invasive weeds. To her surprise she spotted little bluestem and three species of native milkweed. She already knew she didn't want a career as an academic scientist. But she came up with the idea of forming a group to study this ecosystem: “a dream team of people I wanted to work with.”

                                She knew Laura Merwin from the University of Chicago, and later she met Lauren Umek, a project manager for the Chicago Park District. She invited them to brunch to pitch her idea to research plants growing on slag. Not for any obvious career goal. Just from sheer curiosity.

                                Merwin and Umek were excited to join her project - which she called a “reverse side hustle,” since it involved a lot of work, but didn't make any money: it actually costs money.

                                And thus the Slag Queens were born.

                                Their first paper, “Urban post-industrial landscapes have unrealized ecological potential,” was published in Restoration Ecology in 2022. It argues that slag fields don't need to be fixed. They have ecological value in and of themselves. And land managers should forget whatever ecosystem was there before. Instead, they should look to more exotic ecosystems as a guide, like the dolomite prairies of Illinois, where magnesium-rich rock near the surface makes it hard for ordinary plants to thrive. Slag too is rich in magnesium.

                                The Slag Queens are continuing their revolutionary work even now! For more, start here:

                                • Carrie Gous, The beauty of slag, https://mag.uchicago.edu/science-medicine/beauty-slag

                                Some of what I just wrote is a paraphrase of this article.

                                (2/2)

                                KatykayayK This user is from outside of this forum
                                KatykayayK This user is from outside of this forum
                                Katykayay
                                wrote last edited by
                                #21

                                @johncarlosbaez How much do I love this story? Let me count the ways. . .or never mind. It's just singularly delightful!

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • John Carlos BaezJ John Carlos Baez

                                  @quoidian - thanks! The ethics of "invasive species" will need to be rethought as we go deeper into the Anthropocene and "pristine nature" becomes a thing of the past. This book looks interesting!

                                  cbudC This user is from outside of this forum
                                  cbudC This user is from outside of this forum
                                  cbud
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #22

                                  @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                  I think there is a perception that resources for invasive species management are directed at any invasive species wherever they may occur simply because it is non-native. Or that the concern about invasive species impacts (and scientific work on the topic) are unobjective and inappropriately value laden. The reality is that the vast majority of invasive species are largely or completely unmanageable, and most interventions must be defensible from a variety of perspectives before the limited resources that may be available are invested. As someone who has lived and worked on oceanic islands a lot, invasive species' impacts are very conspicuous. Their impacts also create ethical dilemmas in relation to the fate of endemic biodiversity. Functional equivalency arguments don't hold up IMO as they seem to reflect our tendency to view nature as being there primarily to serve human needs. I think this slag heap site acting as refuge for specialist native species is cool, but the story says only a little about the legitimacy, ethics or complexity of our concerns about invasive species - these intersect with so many different aspects of the environment, human health and welfare.

                                  cbudC 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • cbudC cbud

                                    @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                    I think there is a perception that resources for invasive species management are directed at any invasive species wherever they may occur simply because it is non-native. Or that the concern about invasive species impacts (and scientific work on the topic) are unobjective and inappropriately value laden. The reality is that the vast majority of invasive species are largely or completely unmanageable, and most interventions must be defensible from a variety of perspectives before the limited resources that may be available are invested. As someone who has lived and worked on oceanic islands a lot, invasive species' impacts are very conspicuous. Their impacts also create ethical dilemmas in relation to the fate of endemic biodiversity. Functional equivalency arguments don't hold up IMO as they seem to reflect our tendency to view nature as being there primarily to serve human needs. I think this slag heap site acting as refuge for specialist native species is cool, but the story says only a little about the legitimacy, ethics or complexity of our concerns about invasive species - these intersect with so many different aspects of the environment, human health and welfare.

                                    cbudC This user is from outside of this forum
                                    cbudC This user is from outside of this forum
                                    cbud
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #23

                                    @quoidian @johncarlosbaez

                                    TL;DR people concerned about invasive species and advocating for some action are more aware than most about how unattainable some vision of "pristine nature" is. #IAS #biodiversity #anthropocene

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • Jürgen HubertJ Jürgen Hubert shared this topic

                                    Reply
                                    • Reply as topic
                                    Log in to reply
                                    • Oldest to Newest
                                    • Newest to Oldest
                                    • Most Votes


                                    • Login

                                    • Login or register to search.
                                    Powered by NodeBB Contributors
                                    • First post
                                      Last post