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  3. Epic CEO [Tim Sweeney] says AI disclosures like Steam's make "no sense" because AI will be involved in "nearly all" future game development

Epic CEO [Tim Sweeney] says AI disclosures like Steam's make "no sense" because AI will be involved in "nearly all" future game development

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  • D darkkite@lemmy.ml

    would you avoid games with DLSS? if not where exactly is that line since it requires similar workflows as used in creating LLMs and contributes more to model development for nvidia and amd?

    apotheotic (she/her)A This user is from outside of this forum
    apotheotic (she/her)A This user is from outside of this forum
    apotheotic (she/her)
    wrote on last edited by
    #52

    The location of the line is for each person to decide for themselves. Mine sits just before ai gets involved in the creation process. Llms for code, genai for art assets or concept art, that sort of thing. Won’t buy a game that involved that.

    Personally I don’t avoid DLSS but I am always overjoyed to see a game not leaning on it to reach playable framerates, since I find the graphical artifacting quite annoying and it doesn’t seem like they have a solution to it since I continue to see the swimming haze in modern titles.

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    • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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      zotethemighty@lemmy.zip
      wrote on last edited by zotethemighty@lemmy.zip
      #53

      If most games will contain AI content, then an “AI-free” badge couldn’t be more important. He must understand that that statement is a complete logical fallacy, right?

      C R 2 Replies Last reply
      53
      • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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        holymole@lemmy.ca
        wrote on last edited by
        #54

        I guess I won’t be buying nearly all games.

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        • Z zotethemighty@lemmy.zip

          If most games will contain AI content, then an “AI-free” badge couldn’t be more important. He must understand that that statement is a complete logical fallacy, right?

          C This user is from outside of this forum
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          cashsky@sh.itjust.works
          wrote on last edited by cashsky@sh.itjust.works
          #55

          Except every tool used for development is going to have some level of AI in it and unless you are also building your own AI free tool you aren’t going to know what’s truly AI free. AI is here and the cat’s out of the bag. There is no putting it back in at this point. We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.

          P nagaram@startrek.websiteN T C 4 Replies Last reply
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          • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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            julysfire@lemmy.worldJ This user is from outside of this forum
            julysfire@lemmy.worldJ This user is from outside of this forum
            julysfire@lemmy.world
            wrote on last edited by julysfire@lemmy.world
            #56

            Epic CEO [Tim Sweeney] is an idiot

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            • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
              This post did not contain any content.
              coldwater@lemmy.caC This user is from outside of this forum
              coldwater@lemmy.caC This user is from outside of this forum
              coldwater@lemmy.ca
              wrote on last edited by
              #57

              And wonder why Steam is succeeded but Epic is an AI slop wasteland

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              • C cashsky@sh.itjust.works

                Except every tool used for development is going to have some level of AI in it and unless you are also building your own AI free tool you aren’t going to know what’s truly AI free. AI is here and the cat’s out of the bag. There is no putting it back in at this point. We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.

                P This user is from outside of this forum
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                pedz@lemmy.ca
                wrote on last edited by pedz@lemmy.ca
                #58

                We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.

                We can’t even restrain ourselves on the usage of weapons, the extraction of natural resources, the usage of energy, consumerism, or cars. The way our societies are working will not give much chance to ethics.

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                • Z zotethemighty@lemmy.zip

                  If most games will contain AI content, then an “AI-free” badge couldn’t be more important. He must understand that that statement is a complete logical fallacy, right?

                  R This user is from outside of this forum
                  R This user is from outside of this forum
                  rizzrustbolt@lemmy.world
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #59

                  It’s Tim Sweeney, he doesn’t understand where the sun goes at night.

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                  • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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                    imetators@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #60

                    Tim: Valve doesn’t understand the market. AI is going to lead gaming industry.

                    Also Tim: VALVE IS A MONOPOLY AND SHOULD SEIZE TO EXIST.

                    ultragigagigantic@lemmy.mlU 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • oni ᓚᘏᗢC oni ᓚᘏᗢ

                      nahh men. This is why you (Epic) are giving away games every week for free. Nobody likes you

                      I This user is from outside of this forum
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                      imetators@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #61

                      Even giving out great games for free doesn’t make Epic more likeable. That is a next level failure.

                      If anything, other companies need to do the same as Valve does to gain respect and popularity. But, here we are.

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                      • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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                        gloomsday@lemmy.world
                        wrote on last edited by gloomsday@lemmy.world
                        #62

                        Using AI for checking a code, and then double checking it yourself is different than some waste of sperm dictating prompts to AI, and telling his friends at parties while high on ketamine adderol and coke “this is going to be the next Morrowind x Cyberpunk x Mario Brother Kart Theft Auto” is the AI badge Valve is talking about.

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                        • N Nils

                          Then some clueless person complains that Steam dominates the market. When Epic is constantly shooting their foot.

                          People like to make informed decisions and those labels help. In proper countries even beer have content labels to say if there is rice or corn with the barley.

                          I This user is from outside of this forum
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                          imetators@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #63

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                          • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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                            theobvioussolution@lemmy.ca
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #64

                            As a CEO you can decide whether to piss off on what your potential consumers demand and don’t. Obviously, there’s a reason why the EGS is in the shitty place it is and Steam isn’t. EGS focuses on developers and publishers even when it means pissing on consumers. Steam might have spearled modern DRM “subscription”-based marketplaces, but they’ve also continued to cater to consumer demands even when it opposed their interests and they could have chosen to ignore them anyway.

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                            • C cashsky@sh.itjust.works

                              Except every tool used for development is going to have some level of AI in it and unless you are also building your own AI free tool you aren’t going to know what’s truly AI free. AI is here and the cat’s out of the bag. There is no putting it back in at this point. We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.

                              nagaram@startrek.websiteN This user is from outside of this forum
                              nagaram@startrek.websiteN This user is from outside of this forum
                              nagaram@startrek.website
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #65

                              LLMs are actually just massively improved spell checks. If you’ve used an IDE with in line error detection, technically that’s AI now.

                              I do wish we’ve drawn the line more clearly on what “AI” usage means in terms of “this game was made with AI”

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                              • alessandro@lemmy.caA alessandro@lemmy.ca
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                                Saapas
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #66

                                Well that’s probably true

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                                • R ryathal@sh.itjust.works

                                  It’s becoming nearly impossible to write code in a corporate environment without AI. Everyone has AI auto complete at the minimum, and AI code generation is at a point where it’s at least even with an entry level dev.

                                  P This user is from outside of this forum
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                                  PonyOfWar
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #67

                                  I’m sure that’s the case at some companies, but where I work, I can freely choose which tools I use for coding and whether or not to use AI, despite one of my bosses being obsessed with it.

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                                  • T theobvioussolution@lemmy.ca

                                    As a CEO you can decide whether to piss off on what your potential consumers demand and don’t. Obviously, there’s a reason why the EGS is in the shitty place it is and Steam isn’t. EGS focuses on developers and publishers even when it means pissing on consumers. Steam might have spearled modern DRM “subscription”-based marketplaces, but they’ve also continued to cater to consumer demands even when it opposed their interests and they could have chosen to ignore them anyway.

                                    K This user is from outside of this forum
                                    K This user is from outside of this forum
                                    krooklochurm@lemmy.ca
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #68

                                    I’d argue that it was always in their interest to listen to their customers

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                                    • C cashsky@sh.itjust.works

                                      Except every tool used for development is going to have some level of AI in it and unless you are also building your own AI free tool you aren’t going to know what’s truly AI free. AI is here and the cat’s out of the bag. There is no putting it back in at this point. We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.

                                      T This user is from outside of this forum
                                      T This user is from outside of this forum
                                      theobvioussolution@lemmy.ca
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #69

                                      What I consider sad is that we are really getting no option to run it locally. It’s an excuse to turn everything into a live service where not even a subscription saves you because you can run out of “tokens” now. I have absolutely no issue with OSS tools incorporating LocalLLM aids. If people have modern GPUs then they can use local LLMs in some form or another.

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                                      • S Saapas

                                        Well that’s probably true

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                                        boonhet@sopuli.xyz
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #70

                                        I think it’s a case of literal AI-generated assets vs AI assistants used in the process of work.

                                        S 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • nagaram@startrek.websiteN nagaram@startrek.website

                                          LLMs are actually just massively improved spell checks. If you’ve used an IDE with in line error detection, technically that’s AI now.

                                          I do wish we’ve drawn the line more clearly on what “AI” usage means in terms of “this game was made with AI”

                                          T This user is from outside of this forum
                                          T This user is from outside of this forum
                                          theobvioussolution@lemmy.ca
                                          wrote on last edited by theobvioussolution@lemmy.ca
                                          #71

                                          Every single time I think about what LLM are I think about this quote from the game Night in the Woods:

                                          “We’re good at drawing lines through the spaces between stars like we’re pattern-finders, and we’ll find patterns and we like really put our hearts and minds into it and even if we don’t mean to.”

                                          LLMs are based on neural networks. They are little brains that have nothing else to deal with than finding patterns in our own logic and can seem to be smarter than what they really are because of it. Evolution has not weighted them with an ego or urgency, but because it has been trained on ours it can sometimes emulate it. But it fundamentally lacks the complexity of our brains, at least for now. It is still amazing what they can do given so little, and it is amazing how convincing they can be with their answers when they are completely wrong. It is a viral form of intelligence.

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