Epic CEO [Tim Sweeney] says AI disclosures like Steam's make "no sense" because AI will be involved in "nearly all" future game development
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PC gamers (sample size: at least 1) say they struggle to think of anything valuable that Tim Sweeney has ever said.
App Store policies from Apple and Google are unacceptable. That’s Sweeney. Broken clock right twice a day and all.
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“Will” is still a future tense word, right? As in “later, not now”
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I like AI, and see no issue with disclosing how it is applied. People who are pro-AI would like to further hone their craft, by understanding what workflows and issues are involved. Anti-AI folk can simply avoid what they dislike. Either way, it is win-win.
The main problem I have besides the ethics is that people keep trying to pass off substandard art as non-ai when it still just looks worse.
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Except every tool used for development is going to have some level of AI in it and unless you are also building your own AI free tool you aren’t going to know what’s truly AI free. AI is here and the cat’s out of the bag. There is no putting it back in at this point. We as a society need to figure out how to use it ethically.
As if down voting me is going to make the AI problem go away. Lemmy baffles me. People on here are the most pro FOSS but luddites at the same time when it comes to AI.
There is no going back from anyone this. We are gonna have to figure out how to live with the consequences of AI. We should be making a lot more noise about AI to law makers. It’s coming for all of our jobs now matter what sector you work in. At some point people are going to have to accept it and make the best of it.
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I mean he’s not wrong, it’s like saying we’re going to have a flag for whether the game uses stock/bought assets or like saying whether an animated movie uses cgi.
The real issue is that many are using AI poorly, but as developers become more familiar with the tools and work them more seamlessly into their workflow, it can be beneficial.
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yea that’s just playing on semantics. Of course machine learning will keep assisting many different workflows, thank you Tim.
Go ahead with your ML-assisted procedural animations, your ML-enhanced denoising, your ML-powered stochastic mesh pruning.What people don’t want is generated visuals/music that try and pass off as art. I’d love to summon debility to explain that the ruling class doesn’t get it, but they do -it’s a convenient way for them to save on human labor that is also… just too tempting to use for replacing art as well.
“it’s a convenient way for them to-” insert: exploit all culture, our past and present artists, writers, musicians, etc. . . The offense is utterly incomprehensible. Its like the billion dollar relativity thingy, where you just can’t get over the relative size of the comparison to $100,000. The amount of data stolen from past and current IP is too much for the layman to ever consider. It’s the heist of the epoch.
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Never thought I’d agree with Tim Sweeney on anything.
John Carmack has a good take on AI in game dev too.
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yea that’s just playing on semantics. Of course machine learning will keep assisting many different workflows, thank you Tim.
Go ahead with your ML-assisted procedural animations, your ML-enhanced denoising, your ML-powered stochastic mesh pruning.What people don’t want is generated visuals/music that try and pass off as art. I’d love to summon debility to explain that the ruling class doesn’t get it, but they do -it’s a convenient way for them to save on human labor that is also… just too tempting to use for replacing art as well.
AI generated visuals and music are one thing, but one use of AI in that category is giving NPCs actually interesting things to say.
Currently, without AI, they have one or two lines about the weather, or the general state of affairs, but if you can pass an LLM the current state of the world and the player’s recent actions, then run the output through a tts model tuned to a distinct voice to, you’d be making the world feel way deeper than it is now with much more insightful interactions. You could maybe go even further and add infinite mini-quests in a similar manner, but it’s better to start off small.
AI doesn’t have to replace, and the best studios will use it to enhance and add to their art, the average ones will avoid it, and the worst ones will use it to replace art.
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I’ve said this before that typically people don’t know what they are talking about AI, but I don’t expect this from people who SHOULD know what AI is.
There could be technologies that AI can assist with, hell I’m not a game dev but I assume even back in the day, devs used tricks and technologies that today could be considered as AI
However AI as in it will write you code, generate you a game and write you a story? Hell no.
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Handmade clothes may be not the norm but they are not extinct. Dresses, scarfs and accesorising can be found handmade. Luxury market is in majority handmade.
The point is that the label is not pointless. It exist and will exist in the future. I just hope that games with human art won’t be considered a luxury.
I think a lot of what was art will die, you have logo generators and random people image generators that used to be done by a graphic artist, or a photgrapher.
ThisPersonDoesNotExist - Random AI Generated Photos of Fake Persons
Generate random human face in 1 click and download it! AI generated fake person photos: man, woman or child.
(this-person-does-not-exist.com)
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As if down voting me is going to make the AI problem go away. Lemmy baffles me. People on here are the most pro FOSS but luddites at the same time when it comes to AI.
There is no going back from anyone this. We are gonna have to figure out how to live with the consequences of AI. We should be making a lot more noise about AI to law makers. It’s coming for all of our jobs now matter what sector you work in. At some point people are going to have to accept it and make the best of it.
People on here are the most pro FOSS but luddites at the same time when it comes to AI.
This is consistent. Do you realize who the Luddites were?
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Never thought I’d agree with Tim Sweeney on anything.
John Carmack has a good take on AI in game dev too.
There’s a huge difference between AI for behind the scenes things, and AI artwork, animation, and voices.
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AI generated visuals and music are one thing, but one use of AI in that category is giving NPCs actually interesting things to say.
Currently, without AI, they have one or two lines about the weather, or the general state of affairs, but if you can pass an LLM the current state of the world and the player’s recent actions, then run the output through a tts model tuned to a distinct voice to, you’d be making the world feel way deeper than it is now with much more insightful interactions. You could maybe go even further and add infinite mini-quests in a similar manner, but it’s better to start off small.
AI doesn’t have to replace, and the best studios will use it to enhance and add to their art, the average ones will avoid it, and the worst ones will use it to replace art.
And who’s going to be powering that NPC’s LLM model? Unless all you want is a free hotlinked chatbot window disguised as a character? Because the publishers and developers sure as hell won’t power it on their end and if they do you’ll be paying out the ass for it. Otherwise that LLM for an NPC will have to run locally on your own hardware…in addition to the game itself.
So yeah, have fun with that.
And dialogue generation is ALL they can do btw. They can’t navigate a character around a 3d environment or even play against you in a grand strategy game. So, looking at RAM and GPU prices… yeah the novelty of LLM in games will run it’s course pretty quick.
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This is why Epic is losing lol
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Waste of ink really
People are all gonna die, eventually. Might as well get it over with.
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And who’s going to be powering that NPC’s LLM model? Unless all you want is a free hotlinked chatbot window disguised as a character? Because the publishers and developers sure as hell won’t power it on their end and if they do you’ll be paying out the ass for it. Otherwise that LLM for an NPC will have to run locally on your own hardware…in addition to the game itself.
So yeah, have fun with that.
And dialogue generation is ALL they can do btw. They can’t navigate a character around a 3d environment or even play against you in a grand strategy game. So, looking at RAM and GPU prices… yeah the novelty of LLM in games will run it’s course pretty quick.
It’d be a small model run locally, taking up maybe half a GB of VRAM
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This is why Epic is losing lol
Agreed.
What does it cost them to make a checkbox and show the value to the customer?If they fear it, they know that the knowledge will make me think twice on buying it.
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I’ve said this before that typically people don’t know what they are talking about AI, but I don’t expect this from people who SHOULD know what AI is.
There could be technologies that AI can assist with, hell I’m not a game dev but I assume even back in the day, devs used tricks and technologies that today could be considered as AI
However AI as in it will write you code, generate you a game and write you a story? Hell no.
Yes, nuance is important
but
I’d argue that demanding thecustomerseller fill out a 20 page form on what the AI was used for (and additionally which model) would result in the opposite sentiment for the seller and customer.
Theres a line between too little and too much information. -
People are all gonna die, eventually. Might as well get it over with.
The funeral services community liked that.
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There’s a huge difference between AI for behind the scenes things, and AI artwork, animation, and voices.
Technical involvement/assistance: Sure, use whatever tools you have
Artistic: Hm…Maybe. Tell what it was used for and I can say if I agree with it.
